What happens when you stop, On Purpose - with Pamela Dangelmaier

0:00 Before we begin today, I want you to compare this, now this,

0:13 and finally, complete silence felt that shift. We all live in a world that fills every space with noise, urgency, expectation. But what if the thing we're missing is the space itself? In today's episode, we explore the quiet, the pause, the stillness we often avoid but so desperately need, and how silence, when chosen with intention, can become one of the most powerful tools for clarity, creativity, and resilience. Let's explore with my guest, Pamela Dengelmeyer. Welcome to the show, Mind Glen. I'm your host, Karen Chong, and I'll be diving into the minds of incredible people, each an expert in their very own way.

1:02 Together we'll uncover insights and share ideas so you can be inspired and empowered to navigate your own unique journey in life. Ready to get curious and discover what's possible? Let's blend.

1:16 Today I'm joined by Pamela Danglemeyer from British Columbia in Canada. Hi, Pamela. Hi, Karen. Thank you for having me and for providing me with this wonderful opportunity to yeah, to spend some time with you and to talk about things that I think are mutually important to us and, and I hope for your, for your listeners as well. Yeah, I know that you are a mindfulness expert, a TE DX speaker, and the author of The Power of the Past and many more actually, and we will dive into that. So very excited to have you here on mine Blend.

1:57 Welcome to the show. What we're going to talk about today is something that I'm personally very interested in and is silence. Now, before we dive into why we're talking about silence, I would like to ask you, Pamela, to kind of tell us a little bit more about your journey and what drew you to silence in the first place. Well, thank you for that. Yeah. What drew me to silence, You know, I have lived a very busy and curious life. I've worn many different hats in e-commerce and in business. And what I discovered a number of years ago, now, this is going back a good 20 years or so, is I was so caught up in the busyness of life that it overwhelmed me.

2:46 And I had experienced what, you know, what could clinically be called a breakdown in my life. I, I wasn't able to function the way I normally thought I could function. I was overwhelmed with thoughts. I was physically stressed to the point where I I developed a thing called hyperacusis, where literally everything was so loud in my life that even my voice itself was overwhelming. And that almost forced me into a world of silence. And in that silence, I discovered just the most amazing things, most of which was that I had this internal wisdom that I had drowned out in the busyness of my life.

3:37 And when I discovered that, I realized that I could then take advantage of that and use it as a powerful tool to guide my life to go from overwhelm to clarity and to be able to live a life of purpose, live a life of calmness and change that busyness into intentionality. So that was really the beginning of this journey for me. And I went from there to actually getting some some training. I have a graduate degree in mindfulness based teaching and learning. I went on to get a certification as a life coach and propelled me forward into what I do now, which is motivational speaking and workshops centered on the principles of mindfulness, specifically integrating pauses into our day and the power that that can bring to people's lives.

4:43 Wow, I have never met anyone who has experienced hyperacusis. Yeah, yeah. You don't want to experience it. Trust me, you don't. When you were describing it. When you were describing it, I was thinking back through the times when I have nightmares, and in the nightmares it was either chaos or it was war or something similar to that effect. The whole town was surrounding me, people are screaming. And then of course I got up because it was a nightmare and then it was all silent. So it maybe reminded me of that experience.

5:16 Yeah, it's uncomfortable for sure. And I think that to some degree, modern society is suffering from hyperacusis in general because our world is so filled with noises and distractions and sounds that we almost have become used to it. And that drowning out of what I call that beautiful moment or moments of silence. It's like, as I mentioned in my TE DX talk, it's like modern society has silenced silence and there is so much wonderful treasures to be found in silence. And so that hyperacusis forced me to be silent and that is when I discovered it.

6:07 And so it's what I want to share with other people. It's the gift that I want to give to others. Yeah, and it's what you're advocating. Silence. It's almost like you're giving silence a voice, which sounds like an oxymoron. But I definitely do find that in other conversations that I've had with other people, some of them are career coaches, some are just mentors of mine. And there's more and more value in focusing, not multitasking and just taking a moment, take a step back and evaluating, reflecting, and then take action.

6:47 So I definitely see that being advocated a lot more and more. And it's like you said, our world is noisy, especially you've heard of squeaky wheel gets the oil in the world like that. How do you go about advocating for silence? Well, the biggest stumbling block that I have come across when I advocate for silence, as you say, is that people innately sense a feeling of fear when they experience silence, true silence, for the first time. It is rather scary because all of a sudden we are aware of all the thoughts that are running through our head, all the feelings in our physical feelings in our body.

7:38 What are our our, yeah, our arms are feeling like, our legs are feeling like our heart is pounding, whatever it might be. And also the emotions and those external sounds tend to drown those things out. So when we introduce silence, it can be a scary event for people and so they will shy away from it. But what I like to help people understand is that, you know, intentional silence doesn't mean that you have to go and sit on a beach in Bali cross legged with candles burning and incense and or go up into some, you know, nature retreat somewhere in a, in a small Hut and cut yourself off from society and live totally in silence.

8:18 That is, that is the extreme end of it. And it for most people, it's not attainable and it's not really what they want to do. But what I like to encourage people is to build small moments of silence into their day with intention. So they actually say to themselves, for instance, you're traveling to work. If you're driving in a car, a lot of people have their radio on, they have a podcast playing, or they have music playing, or they have something going on. I say for that short amount of time or even just for part of your journey, just drive in silence.

8:57 Just notice that you're driving. Notice what's around. You have no distractions other than the actual physical act of driving. These are small moments of time where we can build silence into our day and it's very easy to do, but it starts with intentions. So of the people that you've told this to, have they given you the report afterwards, what they experience? Yes, absolutely. And for the most part, it is positive. I would say when people understand that there are no strict rules to this, that there's no amount of time, like you have to do it for 30 minutes a day or 40 minutes a day or whatever it might be.

9:44 When you give people the autonomy to choose when they want to do it, when they choose to do it, it's much more empowering. And inevitably, yes, people will say, wow. I paused for a moment. For instance, before I went into a big meeting, I stood there before the door, before I opened it, I paused. I took a deep breath in. I let it out slowly. I felt myself grounded. And then I entered the room. And it makes the world of difference as opposed to rushing from your desk, rushing from wherever you came from, rushing up the stairs, going into the meeting room and, and standing there and, and either being part of the meeting or presenting or whatever it might be.

10:27 It's those moments of short pause. And yes, I've had very positive feedback from people who's begin to incorporate this into their daily. Life. Yeah. It's so important to not just run around like have this chicken or jumping from imagine you're jumping a Lotus leaf from leave to leave to leave. You don't stop. You're going to sink and die. It's like that. And you know what? I you also just reminded me of when I took my driving test, My I, my instructor knew that I was very nervous. He gave me a glass of water before handing me over to the the examiner.

11:07 I think there's a name and it made the difference. The intentional pause just breaking you up. Or when you see something happening, people are about to fight, they're heated. If you're just a passerby just interrupting that moment, it's already something very useful. Yes, it's very. Yeah. It's very powerful. And you know, and I think intuitively as human beings, we know that. We know that pause can create a space for us to reflect, even if it's for just a millisecond, and then choose a proper response or choose some kind of response.

11:47 You know, it reminds me of a a very well known quote by Viktor Frankel. He said that between stimulus and response there is a space, and in that space is our power to choose our response. And in our response lies our growth and our freedom. And that space can be a millisecond, it can be two seconds, it can be 3 seconds, it could be 5 minutes. It's just an opportunity to go inward and draw from our inner wisdom that will guide us correctly every single time. Yeah, and I do, I do agree that we get a little bit uncomfortable when things are silent.

12:36 And I'm sure you've heard of the silent treatment that many partners experience from their partners, and it's normally associated with negative people being silenced, voices being silenced.

12:53 How would you approach someone who has that perception? Well, that type of, as you say, silent treatment is what I would term sort of a negative use of silence. It's used as a as a power tool against someone and I'm I'm all for power tools for people, for yourself. So in that sense of their experience of silence has been negative, then to understand the intention behind that type of use of silence as opposed to the intention behind the type of silence that I propose, which is for the greater good for you personally, to get yourself grounded, to get yourself turned inwards and to be able to guide yourself with your inner pilot.

13:45 As opposed to an autopilot. Because so often we are just on autopilot. We're, we're just going about our day deflecting and reflecting and, and, and doing things that it's like a, it's like a sailboat without a mast and a sail. We're just being tossed about by the waves. But as soon as we do take those small pauses of time and or longer pauses, as soon as we build those into our daily routine, we begin to understand that we actually do have an inner pilot. And that inner pilot is the one that will guide us, that will serve us best and give us the greatest power to live our lives fully with positivity, intention, clarity, creativity, all of the things that we as human beings possess.

14:37 And each individual is unique and bring something wonderful to this world. If someone is new to this, they are used to having a very hectic lifestyle, just in distractions here and there. What's the first step they can take? Well, the first step is to do the silence with intentions. So as I said, to build a small moment of silence into your day. And I talk about that in my e-book, The Power of the Pause. There's lots of different pauses that one can take, but the very first one, and the easiest really is, as I mentioned already, is to just intentionally pause.

15:18 It can be at any time. It doesn't have to be necessarily before a stressful moment in your day. It could be when you get up in the morning and you're in the bathroom and you're brushing your teeth and whatever it might be, just to take a moment and intentionally pause. Take a breath in, breathe out,

15:41 and that's it. That's a pause. And in that pause, as you begin to build those into your day, you will begin to discover really wonderful things. At the very least it's given your your mind and your body a rest, a rest from your hectic day, from whatever it might be. A rest, a pause, a space to just be. And we have so few of those in our days. So yeah, that just taking a an intentional pause, a deep breath in and out, that's all it takes to begin, and it feels good. It feels good. I do yoga. So whenever I do that, I do feel like when I'm busy at work, just staring at the computer screen, I don't blink and I don't really breathe.

16:33 And I my optometrist told me you need to blink more. Put a post it on your computer. Like next to your computer blinked. Yeah, like even these natural human operations are distracted, distracted, busy. So clearing space in your head, it's really important. Why do you think we have gotten so uncomfortable with stillness? Well, I think because it's just been drowned out with so many other things and we become used to it and then it becomes a habit. And I felt, you know. I'll go and do that. OK, yeah, I know.

17:14 I was just going to say it becomes a habit when and then we don't even remember that we actually had silence in our lives when we were younger already or in other parts of our, our, our days and our lives because things have just become so busy, so loud, so quote, UN quote normalized that we don't even realize it. There were times in our lives earlier when I'm sure that everyone had a quieter time, depending on your age. You know, speaking from myself, I grew up in a time when there wasn't any Internet.

17:53 There wasn't, there weren't cell phones, there weren't constant distractions and things giving us, you know, dopamine rushes and, and pulling our attention constantly away from ourselves, from our relationships with others. And so it's become the norm. So of course, when we introduce silence into people's lives or encourage them, it's unknown territory for many people. And people are often afraid of unknown territory of change, of things that aren't known. But as I said, if you introduce it in small doses, yeah, pretty much I'm, I'm pretty sure that most people will agree with me that there is a magical wonderful thing that happens when you do pause, even for a moment and notice your breath.

18:41 Yeah, if you're usually really responsive when you get a message, you respond right away. People can see that you're typing. When you don't do that, people think, Oh my God, what's wrong with Pamela? Like, where is she? And this afternoon, I was not really talking to my husband. We're both at home. And at the end of the day, I was like, we haven't really talked all day. Are you OK? We are both OK. But the fact that we haven't actually made noise made me felt strange because usually there'll be something on.

19:18 There's music or TV or we're on meetings. So yeah, we have gotten used to just constantly having distractions. Absolutely, yeah. I recently read a book actually by Sarah Anderson, and it's called The Lost Art of Silence, and it talks all about this, that in years past, in centuries past, silence was a huge part of the human existence. And as we have moved forward through the centuries, it has become less and less and less and less. And I really believe that we're losing an opportunity to create clarity and calmness, focus and purpose in our lives if we allow silence to slip away, because silence gives us the opportunity to recognize what's important for us as individuals in our lives.

20:14 And therefore we can then live healthier, happier, more fulfilling lives. So it really is, I believe, crucial for people to to begin to work moments of of pause into their daily routine. Yeah. And experience it because society won't give it to you necessarily. You have to be intentional about claiming back silence that you deserve. That's right. How do? You think silence intentionally building silence into your routine. How do you think that relates to how well somebody listens? They're very closely connected, Absolutely listening.

20:59 I believe truly listening, mindfully listening to someone else is one of the greatest gifts that you can give to another person. So often in this world we don't feel heard. We don't feel truly listened to. We sense that when we're speaking or talking to someone, whether it's our partner or a Co worker or a stranger in the library, when we we sense innately that when we're speaking, if they're not truly listening to us, we feel cut off from them. We feel distanced from them, not understood, not appreciated, not given any kind of value or respect.

21:50 And so mindful listening really is truly exactly that. It's listening with intention to what the other person is saying, allowing them to speak, allowing them to express themselves, and doing our very best to avoid automatically beginning to formulate what we're going to say next, because that's often what happens. Someone will say something, they say something, they say something, they say something, and it goes back and forth like this like a tennis match. But there really isn't the intention on both sides to truly listen to the other.

22:27 So yes, they are completely tied together. They're talking at each other, not with each other. I have experienced that there's so many times in my career being. Exactly, Karen, that is it. It's the intentionality and being present in the moment and it's not the norm. It is and that's what's so that is that is I guess the the the challenge that that one faces as a mindful person is that it isn't the norm. So when 1, you know, you're in a meeting or you're in a, even having a conversation with someone, the it's not normal to really sit and listen and people will feel it immediately and think, well, what's going on here?

23:10 She's really listening to what I'm saying. They'll notice it intuitively. And in meetings there's often the pressure to get it done. We've got 20 minutes for this meeting. We've got to say what's got to be said. We've got to do what's got to be done and we've got to go to the next thing. And if you take the time to really listen and to pause after someone has spoken, before you actually speak, people will turn heads and go, what's up with her? What's going on? But it's not a bad thing. It's a good thing because inevitably when you do respond, you will respond from a place of knowing and A and a place of understanding of what has been said.

23:45 And usually what will come out are words of empathy, words of wisdom, words of creativity, whatever it might be, because you've truly listened and now you are responding instead of reacting. Yeah, it's asking the questions about something the person just said that has. That happens a lot actually. People are distracted or they weren't paying attention. So have you encountered any misperception of what you're saying about silence? Because maybe we associate silence with doing nothing and usually doing nothing is not productive.

24:28 Again, it's associated with negativity. Yes. Have you encountered that? Yeah. Well, with some of my clients, yeah, because there are, these are high achievers, these are people who are used to doing going, being travelling, always on the go. And so when I suggest the notion of pause and well, I don't have time to pause, you know, what does that? What good is that going to do for me? And I say, yes, you do have time to pause because we have a misperception about what pausing is and what it means and how valuable it is.

25:03 If we looked at pausing, as valuable as, as you know, presenting in a meeting or as valuable as finishing a project or as valuable of whatever you value is high, and we set it at the same level, amazing things can happen. And pausing is not not doing. Pausing isn't stopping. You know, it's like when I tell people that, for instance, the concept that silence isn't the absence of something, but it's the presence of everything. And in so in pausing, you're actually dipping into the well of all that you are, all of that creative power, all of that past history and wisdom and your value system.

25:56 And what is it that you want to bring to this world? And what is it that you want to achieve? And if you don't allow an opportunity to pause, where are you drawing your inspiration from? Where is it coming from? So it's super valuable. And yes, it does take some people a while to understand that pausing is not just doing nothing. Pausing is actually doing everything. Yeah, My parents, for example, they, if they see me at home not doing anything when I was a kid, I think they told me to go do something.

26:31 Right, right. Well, you know, and, and I understand that, but the truth is, is that we physically need pauses as human beings. We cannot be expected. We all know what happens to people. We have them in our lives. We know them either personally or through relationships with, with coworkers or friends. Those people who are driven, and I mean driven in the sense of they go from the moment they get up in the morning until they stop at night. What often happens with people like that? They have some kind of physical or mental breakdown at some point in their lives.

27:07 It may not manifest right away, but you're pretty well assured that at some point that chain is going to break. So we physically need pauses for our brain, for our our our physicality, for our emotions, and literally for our bodies. We need pause. That's why we sleep every night. But we can also bring micro pauses into our day. Absolutely. Yes, micro pauses is important. Being able to work something in step by step, breaking them into small steps. That's also another reoccurring theme that I've been hearing.

27:48 Yes, yeah, because it all has to do with overwhelm, again, because of of the society, the culture that we have created asks us to always be on and to go, go, go and do, do, do. And yes, people have achieved amazing things. Absolutely. Look at our world now. This world is an amazing place. As we said, you are in the UK, I'm on the West Coast of Canada here. We are having a wonderful conversation. And that's because there are people behind the technology that allows us to do this. So yes, this is wonderful, but we also need to balance it, balance it with self reflection and self-care.

28:34 And when we do that, I suggest one way to do that, one very powerful and effective way is to build that pause into your day. OK, well we have done anything but being silent for the last about 30 minutes, so I'd like to play a lightning round with you to finish off our episode. So just step reaction. No. OK, so you encourage us to build small pauses into our lives. What's a pause practice that you always it's your go to. Mm Hmm. My pause practice is I actually have an app on my phone, a mindfulness app that rings a bell randomly once an hour.

29:20 Randomly. Randomly. OK, so I have it, you know, I have my cell phone with me as most people do. It's part of, of, of the, what I have the technology that I carry with me. And that little bell will ring randomly every hour, except when I'm, I said it, I'm sleeping obviously. And the bell sound will last for maybe 5 seconds. And when that bell rings, I take a pause. I take a deep breath in and I let the breath out. It's based on the teaching from Tiknad Han, Vietnamese Buddhist monk, very, very prolific writer.

29:59 And he actually began to introduce this idea of a random bell. And it's very easy to do. And it's amazing what happens when that bell rings, when you notice what are you doing right at that moment in time. Am I rushing? Am I busy? Am I? How am I feeling? What's my breath like? So yes. Yeah, that's a very good point. It's waking you up, like shaking you, yes. Come out of whatever you're in. Yes, in a gentle way, because it's like a it's a nice light thing. That's all that it is. I was. Going to ask how does it sound like?

30:31 Yes, yes, it's a it's a lovely, just nice light bell sound. And I'm sure you said it when like you need to focus for example your writing or talking to someone. Yes. Next one What's one place where silence surprised you? Well, I would say I'd have to go back to when I was giving my TE DX talk and I referred back to a time when I was a teenager and I scuba dived and it was the first time that I experienced a true immersive silence as I dipped down under the waves. It was noisy up above, lots of sounds, and I went below and all I could hear was the sound of my own breath going in and going out.

31:18 And that was admittedly somewhat unnerving to begin with. But then I began to love it. And yes, it was surprising for me that that immersive, all-encompassing silence. Yeah, and because you were scuba diving too. You, you were deep. Yes, and I was floating. I was floating, you know. So I was, it was a world unknown to me. It was a physical feeling. It was an emotional experience that that I hadn't experienced up above the water. So it was quite profound for me and one that really did change me in many ways, because at that point in time I recognized the wonderful power of that silence.

32:14 And it made an impact on you. It did, yes. Yeah, it did. Next one What has been the most effective way to make someone go silent immediately? To make someone go, OK, well, I think focus and intention and a very soft voice from me. Often when someone is speaking and they might be upset, they might be, you know, angry or or emotional in some way. My first step is to really look at them in a very caring and empathetic way, even if they're angry at me. And then to speak with kind and gentle words, but in a very soft, gentle voice.

32:55 This can be very disarming for people and also says to them, listen, I care about you. I'm listening to you. What is it that you want to say? Yeah, yeah. There's no use pouring oil and fire, really. No. And it's it is a challenge because sometimes we feel we feel attacked personally or we feel a strong emotion ourselves. But again, it's that moment of quick pause, breath in, breath out, and then to really intentionally look at that person with understanding and empathy as much as you can muster, and then to speak in a gentle voice can be very, very helpful in connection and also in disarming what could be a hot, volatile situation.

33:48 Yeah. OK. Last one. Do you talk in the elevator? Wow, that's a good question. If yes, actually I do. I do. If I go into an elevator and I see strangers there, I will do my very best to make a connection with them. I will say something like, oh, wow, that's a great dress you have on or oh, you know, oh, I didn't know this was going down. I thought we were going up something, anything. Very rarely. No, I won't stand in an elevator and be silent with people. And even as I say, even just a smile is a way of communicating with with people just to let them know, hey, you know, here we are in an elevator together.

34:34 OK? Might be like 5 seconds that we're together, but it's going to be an enjoyable experience. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's interesting because I am definitely in this camp of not talking in the elevator. I I'm having a conversation with a friend. I was stuck. When someone comes in, I'll stop, mainly because I don't want anyone else to know what we're talking about. But it also depends on where you are, because in London there's a stereotype that you don't look anyone in the eye, you don't talk to anyone.

35:06 So it's perfectly acceptable to not talk or look or smile at someone if you're in the elevator with them. I smile because I that's just something I do. So I still smile. May not talk to them, but I acknowledge their presence and that's what you're doing. Exactly. Exactly. You acknowledge their presence. And I mean the question that, you know, we have to ask ourselves in situations like that where the culture says don't look, don't smile, don't talk. The question you might want to ask yourself when you get in a situation like that is what's a loving or wise choice that I could choose right now?

35:46 Yeah. And even if it is to break the norm and smile, to smile at people, yeah, look them in the eye and, and smile like, OK, yeah, we're all here in this elevator and says we're not supposed to talk, but I'm going to smile at you. Yeah. I'm not talking, yeah, I'm talking with my eyes. That's right. You're talking with your emotions and your and your smile. Yeah. Well, thank you very much today, Pamela. It's a topic that I am really passionate about as well. Just the power of being there still in a world of chaos.

36:22 It's something that I really swear by, partly because of my field of work, project management, but also because I see increasingly that it's really needed. It is, it is and it's, it's a simple, attainable practice that anybody can incorporate. And, you know, that's one of the reasons that I wrote my e-book, the Power of the Pause, because I had so many people asking me, how do I start? Where do I begin? How can I incorporate this into my life? And it's, it's a lovely little book booklet about, you know, 30 pages long or so.

36:54 It has lots of tips in it, lots of great ideas of how you can build pauses into your day. There's even like a A7 day challenge at the end where you can try a different pause technique each day where you can journal about it and see which one works for you. Because the truth is, I'm not here to tell people how to do it for them. It's like a buffet. There's opportunities and choices that fit for each person individually. And but once you find it, my gosh, the the golden treasures that can then can come out of that beautiful space are are wonderful.

37:32 And so, yeah. It's just like an enlightenment, almost. Yeah, yeah. I will also leave Pamela's information where you can connect with her in the show notes. So listeners, if you found today's conversation resonating, definitely keep the conversation going. Connect with me and Pamela. Thank you. Thank you, Karen, so much for this opportunity. It's been wonderful. And as you said, it's an oxymoron to be talking about silence, but, yeah, but that's what makes it fun and and interesting and creative.

38:08 I love that. So again, thank you so much. Thank you for being our guest on Mind One. Thanks for listening to this episode of Mind One. Maybe enjoy the conversation. Don't forget to follow and share it with anyone who needs to hear it. And let's keep the conversation going. Connect with me on LinkedIn or leave me a comment. Until next time, stay curious, keep exploring, and let's continue to blend our minds and discover what's possible.